Comments on: Operator 0.8b is Available http://mike.kaply.com/2007/07/03/operator-08b-is-available/ Mozilla, money, microformats and more Fri, 03 Feb 2012 19:32:05 -0600 hourly 1 http://wordpress.org/?v=3.3.1 By: Nikola http://mike.kaply.com/2007/07/03/operator-08b-is-available/#comment-506 Nikola Wed, 05 Dec 2007 18:03:28 +0000 http://www.kaply.com/weblog/2007/07/03/operator-08b-is-available/#comment-506 I love Operator, but due to beta-testing Flock I haven’t been able to get a version of Operator to keep pace with my browser version for a while. Any chance you can point me at a version I can use now? Thanks I love Operator, but due to beta-testing Flock I haven’t been able to get a version of Operator to keep pace with my browser version for a while. Any chance you can point me at a version I can use now?

Thanks

]]> By: Elias Torres » Blog Archive » Microformats on Google Maps http://mike.kaply.com/2007/07/03/operator-08b-is-available/#comment-505 Elias Torres » Blog Archive » Microformats on Google Maps Thu, 02 Aug 2007 19:31:30 +0000 http://www.kaply.com/weblog/2007/07/03/operator-08b-is-available/#comment-505 [...] Microformats on Google Maps I bumped into Jeremy at XTech 2007. My talk on RDFa (in Operator) followed his and funny enough, many of the questions at the end were around the issues of data typing, universal identification, etc. My opening words were that RDFa is trying to solve those problems and if you want to read more, read it from Keith Alexander. However, this post is not about that. Personally, I’m done arguing RDF vs XML, RDFa vs Microformats, Atom vs RSS, Semantic vs semantic. Can you believe that? From now, I’ll focus more on building instead of evangelizing. Jeremy writes on the news that Google Maps is using microformats very eloquently where the microformat community should go next. I think he’s right. Please go work on Operator, I started but lately have been distracted but I’ll be back Mike! With this seismic shift in the landscape of published microformats, I think we in the microformats community may have to shift our focus slightly. Instead of just being concerned with evangelising the publishing of microformats, it’s now incumbent upon us to show regular Web users how they can consume this wealth of semantic information, whether it’s through the use of a Firefox plugin like Operator, bookmarklets or—soon—native browser support.These icons link to social bookmarking sites where readers can share and discover new web pages. [...] [...] Microformats on Google Maps I bumped into Jeremy at XTech 2007. My talk on RDFa (in Operator) followed his and funny enough, many of the questions at the end were around the issues of data typing, universal identification, etc. My opening words were that RDFa is trying to solve those problems and if you want to read more, read it from Keith Alexander. However, this post is not about that. Personally, I’m done arguing RDF vs XML, RDFa vs Microformats, Atom vs RSS, Semantic vs semantic. Can you believe that? From now, I’ll focus more on building instead of evangelizing. Jeremy writes on the news that Google Maps is using microformats very eloquently where the microformat community should go next. I think he’s right. Please go work on Operator, I started but lately have been distracted but I’ll be back Mike! With this seismic shift in the landscape of published microformats, I think we in the microformats community may have to shift our focus slightly. Instead of just being concerned with evangelising the publishing of microformats, it’s now incumbent upon us to show regular Web users how they can consume this wealth of semantic information, whether it’s through the use of a Firefox plugin like Operator, bookmarklets or—soon—native browser support.These icons link to social bookmarking sites where readers can share and discover new web pages. [...]

]]> By: Steve Holmes http://mike.kaply.com/2007/07/03/operator-08b-is-available/#comment-504 Steve Holmes Thu, 02 Aug 2007 16:31:15 +0000 http://www.kaply.com/weblog/2007/07/03/operator-08b-is-available/#comment-504 Mike, I'm running Flock 0.9.0.1 (and I believe that a 0.9.0.2 patch is coming any day now). I love Operator, but due to beta-testing Flock I haven't been able to get a version of Operator to keep pace with my browser version for a while. Any chance you can point me at a version I can use now? Thanks Mike,
I’m running Flock 0.9.0.1 (and I believe that a 0.9.0.2 patch is coming any day now).
I love Operator, but due to beta-testing Flock I haven’t been able to get a version of Operator to keep pace with my browser version for a while. Any chance you can point me at a version I can use now?

Thanks

]]> By: mkaply http://mike.kaply.com/2007/07/03/operator-08b-is-available/#comment-503 mkaply Thu, 02 Aug 2007 14:32:30 +0000 http://www.kaply.com/weblog/2007/07/03/operator-08b-is-available/#comment-503 Kari: I'm not sure what you mean by language options. As in changing actions so they point to servers other than US? I've considered changing the defaults away from actions as I have specified. Kari:

I’m not sure what you mean by language options. As in changing actions so they point to servers other than US?

I’ve considered changing the defaults away from actions as I have specified.

]]> By: Kari Pätilä http://mike.kaply.com/2007/07/03/operator-08b-is-available/#comment-502 Kari Pätilä Thu, 02 Aug 2007 07:31:36 +0000 http://www.kaply.com/weblog/2007/07/03/operator-08b-is-available/#comment-502 Do you have any plans to introduce language options (other than editing the source directly)? The location bar icon works very well, especially for users who have no idea on what Microformats are. In my opinion, the icon should be visible by default with the "use descriptive names" option checked. That way users with less interest on the technical aspect wouldn't be deterred by terms like "xfolk". Nevertheless, thanks to you, this is the first time I'm able to use Microformats as a core function of a website. Do you have any plans to introduce language options (other than editing the source directly)?

The location bar icon works very well, especially for users who have no idea on what Microformats are. In my opinion, the icon should be visible by default with the “use descriptive names” option checked. That way users with less interest on the technical aspect wouldn’t be deterred by terms like “xfolk”.

Nevertheless, thanks to you, this is the first time I’m able to use Microformats as a core function of a website.

]]> By: mkaply http://mike.kaply.com/2007/07/03/operator-08b-is-available/#comment-501 mkaply Tue, 24 Jul 2007 20:25:37 +0000 http://www.kaply.com/weblog/2007/07/03/operator-08b-is-available/#comment-501 All you have to do to remove the Operator toolbar is select View->Toolbars->Operator Toolbar and it will go away... All you have to do to remove the Operator toolbar is select View->Toolbars->Operator Toolbar and it will go away…

]]> By: Steve http://mike.kaply.com/2007/07/03/operator-08b-is-available/#comment-500 Steve Tue, 24 Jul 2007 19:08:18 +0000 http://www.kaply.com/weblog/2007/07/03/operator-08b-is-available/#comment-500 Not sure if you've got this covered, but it would make sense to me: since you have an option to have operator appear in the status bar, I think there should be an option (or as a side-effect of that one?) to make operator disappear from the toolbar. Sort of like ABP's options for the toolbar button or the statusbar, or DownloadBar's mini v. full mode. Granted, then my status bar might be a bit more cluttered, with ABP and IETab and FoxyTunes and Operator, but I think that's a lot better than reducing space with a bunch of toolbars? I could be wrong, its just a suggestion. Thanks. Not sure if you’ve got this covered, but it would make sense to me: since you have an option to have operator appear in the status bar, I think there should be an option (or as a side-effect of that one?) to make operator disappear from the toolbar. Sort of like ABP’s options for the toolbar button or the statusbar, or DownloadBar’s mini v. full mode. Granted, then my status bar might be a bit more cluttered, with ABP and IETab and FoxyTunes and Operator, but I think that’s a lot better than reducing space with a bunch of toolbars? I could be wrong, its just a suggestion. Thanks.

]]> By: Charles Nepote http://mike.kaply.com/2007/07/03/operator-08b-is-available/#comment-499 Charles Nepote Tue, 17 Jul 2007 10:50:05 +0000 http://www.kaply.com/weblog/2007/07/03/operator-08b-is-available/#comment-499 > any given page could have literally hundreds of types of RDFa on the page, so there’s really no way to have a menuitem for for each RDFa type or to use one specific type on the menu. 1. Ok but isn't it exactly the same problem with microformats ? Their number could grow fast (thanks to Operator ;-). How do you choose which microformats data types are elligible to the Operator bar ? 2. What about agregate some rdf:type with microformats ? For example : a foaf:Person should go in the "contacts" data type, isn't it ? 3. At least, should it be possible to manually configure RDFa data types in the bar ? For example with "Options > Data formats > New RDF type > RDF Type [...............] + Label [..............]". If I enter "http://xmlns.com/foaf/0.1/Person" as the RDF Type, it should create a menu in the bar and detect each object which verify . 4. In terme of UI, a solution should be an UI with 4 levels : -- the first one is something (a menu label, an operator icon ?) called "Semantic Datas" (or something like that) -- the second one (a menu ?) show *every* data types -- the third one (a sub-menu ?) show *every* object corresponding to each data type -- the fourth one (a sub-sub-menu ?) show *every* action corresponding to the given objects What do you think about it ? > any given page could have literally hundreds of types of RDFa on the page, so there’s really no way to have a menuitem for for each RDFa type or to use one specific type on the menu.

1. Ok but isn’t it exactly the same problem with microformats ? Their number could grow fast (thanks to Operator ;-) . How do you choose which microformats data types are elligible to the Operator bar ?

2. What about agregate some rdf:type with microformats ? For example : a foaf:Person should go in the “contacts” data type, isn’t it ?

3. At least, should it be possible to manually configure RDFa data types in the bar ? For example with “Options > Data formats > New RDF type > RDF Type [...............] + Label [..............]“. If I enter “http://xmlns.com/foaf/0.1/Person” as the RDF Type, it should create a menu in the bar and detect each object which verify .

4. In terme of UI, a solution should be an UI with 4 levels :
– the first one is something (a menu label, an operator icon ?) called “Semantic Datas” (or something like that)
– the second one (a menu ?) show *every* data types
– the third one (a sub-menu ?) show *every* object corresponding to each data type
– the fourth one (a sub-sub-menu ?) show *every* action corresponding to the given objects

What do you think about it ?

]]> By: mkaply http://mike.kaply.com/2007/07/03/operator-08b-is-available/#comment-498 mkaply Mon, 16 Jul 2007 13:20:28 +0000 http://www.kaply.com/weblog/2007/07/03/operator-08b-is-available/#comment-498 I'm more than happy to participate in debate about this subject. The data types UI (which is where "RDFa" is used) is not intended to be the primary UI for Operator - the primary UI is considered the actions UI. So I feel pretty comfortable using the term "RDF" in the data format UI to consolidate all RDF. I do like your suggestion of using "Resources" as the user friendly name. I understand the data type is there, but any given page could have literally hundreds of types of RDFa on the page, so there's really no way to have a menuitem for for each RDFa type or to use one specific type on the menu. I’m more than happy to participate in debate about this subject.

The data types UI (which is where “RDFa” is used) is not intended to be the primary UI for Operator – the primary UI is considered the actions UI. So I feel pretty comfortable using the term “RDF” in the data format UI to consolidate all RDF. I do like your suggestion of using “Resources” as the user friendly name.

I understand the data type is there, but any given page could have literally hundreds of types of RDFa on the page, so there’s really no way to have a menuitem for for each RDFa type or to use one specific type on the menu.

]]> By: Charles Nepote http://mike.kaply.com/2007/07/03/operator-08b-is-available/#comment-497 Charles Nepote Mon, 16 Jul 2007 08:44:09 +0000 http://www.kaply.com/weblog/2007/07/03/operator-08b-is-available/#comment-497 Thanks a lot. Yes "there is really no guarantee there is an rdf:type value". As it can be infered in most cases and as "RDFa" is a cryptic name for most users, why not : -- use specific data type when it's possible -- use "Resources" in the other cases (in fact everything has an implicit ) The API for RDFa isn't stable enough ? Is there a way to try some sort of lobyying ? Is it possible to participate to UI debates ? Thanks a lot. Yes “there is really no guarantee there is an rdf:type value”. As it can be infered in most cases and as “RDFa” is a cryptic name for most users, why not :
– use specific data type when it’s possible
– use “Resources” in the other cases (in fact everything has an implicit )

The API for RDFa isn’t stable enough ? Is there a way to try some sort of lobyying ? Is it possible to participate to UI debates ?

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